Beating Around The Bush

1. Either the ’85 or ’92 Landrover.
   Enough room to camp out in in case no facilities are available, and for supplies as well (unlike the Mercs and Toyotas).
   Reliable enough on road and off to not break down every 10 minutes (unlike the Ford or older Landrovers), and simple enough that any shop should be able to fix things if they do break.
   And real roof and windows as well, to make it harder for bears to break in and to better keep the weather out, be it snow, rain, or sand.

2. Eh? No diesel Unimog offered? Pfft!

   Sadly, all the vehicles offered would break down constantly and anything that old will have issues finding parts for repair – ANY repair past oil change, tires and maybe belts.

   So, given the restrictions and the region of the country – the 1960 Willys two tone for the minimal comfort upgrade over other murkins and the fact that it is carburetor fed and not dominated by early computer/electronics/fuel injection crap. Might also be helpful to mention I have worked on and maintained a fair number of the listed (except Fords, never cottoned to them).

3. Any Toyota.

   Traveling companion… hhmmmm wife or a fellow outdoorsman? Camp, fish, hunt, shoot, historic sites…..

   1. What he said. ANY Toyota is the obvious first choice, especially considering these are old school Toyota vehicles.

4. So the first choice is ANY Toyota, though I like the J43 in Blue. NEVER drove this model of Toyota, however old school Toyota’s are even better than today’s modern Toyota’s.

   I have never owned an old school Jeep but I have had friends that have. Cherokee’s from the 90’s and also older Grand Cherokee’s and older 4.0 inline 6 cylinder Wrangler’s. Jeep from the old school days would be second choice to the Yota vehicles.

   I have heard great things about older Mercedes specifically the G Wagon. The G spot would be a close third place to the Jeep’s 2nd place.

   All of the above being said, Ford? Sorry, not to offend but what the fuck? FORD? Putting Ford into a mix of Old school Yoda, Mercedes Benz and real Jeep’s is like bringing a Tonka toy to a monster truck rally. The Ford is what you drive when you want to break down every few miles. Ford’s vehicles always have for the most part and currently do suck. Their management was and is fucking assholes.

   Anyone who given the choice of classic Mercedes, real Jeep and older Yota that picks a Ford must be smokin some damn good shit.

   # Found On Road Dead
   # Fix Or Repair Dailey
   # Fuckin Old Retards Drivem
   # Driver Returns On Foot (backwards).

   Did I mention FUCK FORD? I hope those cock suckers at Ford go out of business when the next slowdown / recession in the vehicle industry comes along.

   1. Teetotaler, you left one out:

      Fucked On Raw Deal

      I bought a new 2000 Ford Ranger that was the worst vehicle I ever owned. Left me on the side of the freeway when I drove it off the lot with a bad oil pressure sending unit (I thought that my oil pressure had gone to zero). It got worse from there. Through sheer stubbornness I kept the thing for 10 years then dumped it for a Toyota Tundra. That Ford was even worse than my first car, a 1974 Datsun 610 station wagon.

      I’ve had Toy Yoda’s for the last 15 years and have never had a problem. Finding parts for a ’78 might be an issue, but that’s assuming it’s gonna break something. Unlikely unless the driver does something dumb. I agree with everything you’ve said.

   2. Fuggin Old Rebuilt Dodge
      Fuked On Race Day

5. ‘85land rover. has auto trans, shoulder cant handle much shifting. Air, if you’ve been in those areas in SW, I don’t need to explain. Big back area. And my mechanic, Sydney Sweeney. Ideally my mechanic would be a middle age Sophia Loren but Sydney assured me she could handle any wrenching or screwing that needed done.

   1. I was wondering which of you old perverts would pick Miss Sweeney as your “mechanic”.

      1. Glad I could oblige. I would have never heard of Miss Sweeney if there hadn’t been that “ genes” hysteria. I saw something about her rebuilding cars. I may have seen a video where she shoots, as well. Though my absolute, undying, devotion is to Sophia Loren, Miss Sweeney might be a bit more practical for this trek.

6. The only vehicle suitable for that wild country is an American 4WD 1/2 or 3/4 ton pickup with a full size box holding a medium sized camper.

   I drive roads and tracks like you describe in Southern BC and Northern Montana all the time. There are no motels or grocery stores on them and I loathe tenting and eating food badly cooked over a camp fire. I did enough of that on many hunting trips when I was young and stupid.

   In the higher portions of your trip the temperature may go down to 35 degrees at night even in mid-summer. A warm dry bed and a propane fuelled stove and fridge, that’s what I want.

   1. So your choice (from the list) would be…?

      1. Don’t bother trying to put the effort in Kim. This is another one of those reading comprehension issues. One has to wonder if this dumbass wrote in Hilary Clinton or JFK when Trump and Biden were on the ballet in 2020.

         And if it’s not a reading comprehension issue, maybe this is another example of someone’s brain on drugs.

         The zombies are real and they are all around us.

         1. CM, I don’t have many rules here but this is one:

            Don’t diss the Longtime Readers (of which Fred is most certainly one).

   2. Those FJ 40s tool around central Australia. I had a HJ60 (1984) when I lived there (2010) and took it on some “roads” that aren’t roads by N. American definitions.

      This is one of the places we drove it to: https://www.google.com/maps/search/Palm+Valley,+Finke+Gorge+National+Park,+Palm+Valley,+Namatjira+NT+0872,+Australia/@-24.0645331,132.681745,12373m/data=!3m1!1e3?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDkyNC4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D

      Google can’t route you there beause there’s no continuous “road”. A significant part of the time you’re driving in the Finke River…which is dry 11.5 months of the year, so no big deal.

      So yeah, the Land Cruisers are as tough as anything Detroit ever made.

      And you’re never going to be *all* that far from a motel or a Supermarket.

      Besides, the rules don’t say you can’t tow something like this https://boreascampers.com/campers/

7. 78 Toyota in blue.

   I’ve driven the little Broncos and my back wouldn’t survive the trip. Willys aren’t much better.
   Older Land Rover but it wasn’t included.

8. I’d choose the 85 Land Rover 110 since it’s enclosed and you said repairs would be done by Hammonds support crew ( they have plenty of experience and evidently can fix whatever Richard broke this time ). I’m assuming that it’s fitted with A/C that actually works. Otherwise I’d go with the 1995 Mercedes-Benz Gelandewagen. That route is going to traverse large portions of High Desert, open range and farm land where there are large stretches of nothing. No towns, no people, no fuel, no water (except maybe a river at the bottom of a 500+ foot drop), nothing.

   20 years ago we did a similar but smaller loop visiting all the National Parks (Yellowstone to the Grand Canyon) in 3 weeks but we cheated and did it in a 38 ft motor home at 6 mpg on paved roads. and still long stretches of nothing.

9. I see a lot of African safari videos with the Land Rovers. When breaking down puts you at risk and parts stores are sparse, you pick reliability. I’d go with a newer model and pray it has AC, as the trip will end in Phoenix in August.

   1. We did a Safari Trip and the portion in Kenya on the open plains of the Serengeti was in an open Land Rover of indeterminate but old vintage. It was little disconcerting to have multiple lionesses within a few feet of the open vehicle. But we were assured that they don’t consider people in Land rovers as either prey or competition. We even had a cheetah use the hood of our Land Rover as a raised scouting platform. Our guide / Ranger apparent knew this cheetah. Because Kenya was a former British Colony there were lots of parts available for old Land Rovers.

      The second part of our trip in the highlands of Tanzania was in Toyota Mini Vans, evidently a common and popular choice. They were everywhere.

10. Just did the PHX to ABQ drive through the Tontos, that drive would hurt most of the old cars, but it is a great drive. Would take forever because I would be going through every river valley drive of which there are many. Would have to go with the Defender 110, but look for the turbo diesel version.

11. :::cracks knuckles:::
    OK, I’ll play! This is called overlanding and I love doing it as much as you love shooting. Gimme the GPX file and I’m ready to go right now. Only I’d be doing it in my lifted 2022 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, built *specifically* for just this kind of travel.

    But with your choice of vehicle? That’s a real toughie. Just about anything with two solid axles, a two-speed transfer case, and locking center, front, and rear differentials would be suitable for purpose. But here’s the $64,000 question: Must it be equipped exactly as shown or can it be added to or modified in any way? If it must be as-is then the 85 Land Rover 110 since it’s already fitted out for this kind of trip. It has an awning, a roof rack and a raised air intake (handy in the desert), and off-road lights. I could mount a nice clamshell style roof-top tent to that roof rack in about an hour and that would be luxury, plus my 12V fridge, tailgate table and plenty of room inside for whatever I’d need to take. If the rooftop tent isn’t permitted then I’ll throw my Gazelle T-4 ground tent on the roof rack, plus about 200 Watts in solar to recharge the Bluetti AC180T powering my fridge. I would also want a way to mount an extra 4 or 5 gallons of fuel to the outside (jerry can or Rotopax) and at least as much potable water.

    Now, if I had to use any of the vehicles shown above, but could do any kind of vehicle modification that makes the choice much more difficult. That 78 FJ43 is the predecessor to the LC78 Troopy (Troop carrier). You can get an Alu-Cab roof conversion done on these and there’s your “tent” right there. It’s essentially a long van so you can easily build it out as a purpose-built overlander, much like the Defenders, and these can and have done the Canning Stock Route in ‘Straya — 1100 miles long, one fuel stop, and it typically takes anywhere from 14-24 days to travel. One of the most grueling overland tracks on the planet, and one I’d sell my left nut to drive.

    I would rather do the trip solo or with one good friend with hardcore off-roading experience and some mechanical ability. Part of my kit would include spares and fluids, a reasonable selection of wrenches and sockets, an M12 ratchet and impact wrench (and chargers), a set of four Maxtrax traction boards, and a bag of recovery gear — soft shackles, tree saver, tow strap, recovery strap, kinetic rope, two snatch blocks, and winch line extension) since I’d rather be on unmaintained 2-tracks rather than forest service gravel. The winch is an absolute requirement, of course.

    Again, depending on the rules, I would choose to modify the vehicle’s interior to fit a sliding kitchen; pantry, hob, etc to save space. My Jeep has a fairly good setup now with a tailgate table for my cooker, my fridge slides out behind me, and a shelf acts as “the pass” to prep plates, cutlery, etc. It works exceedingly well and I would want something similar for a long trip like this.

    I would want to start not in Phoenix, but in Prescott. Why Prescott you ask? One of the country’s best 4×4 shops (Summit 4×4) is based there, and they know from all kinds of classic and current overlanding and rock crawling configurations. I would trust *THEM* to assure me the vehicle was in prime mechanical condition, and no one else in the region, before starting out. Hard limit for me right there.

    I would also want personal protection against predators, commensurate with the laws of each state—Colorado complicates such matters, I believe. But at the very least a pistol and shotgun, and a can of bear spray that would never leave my person in bear country.

    My GPS tracks would be logged to and made public in GaiaGPS and OnX Offroad, my comms gear would be my amateur and GMRS radios plus a Zoleo satellite communicator, and if permitted, a WeBoost cell extender.

    This would in fact be a very easy journey, and could be done leisurely in any time frame the driver desired. Now, take the same set of requirements, same vehicles, same everything, but instead of that loop, the trip is to Deadhorse Alaska on Prudhoe Bay, and now we’re talking. With a side trip along the Dempster Highway to Tuk.

    And yes, I’ve camped in some incredible places with my Rubicon. Along the shore of Lake Huron this past May, on Drummond Island: https://tinyurl.com/23kc982y and https://tinyurl.com/275ulfpg.

12. Probably the 92 defender. Plenty of space and probably AC.

    I’d pick the Toyotas, but I think parts may be an issue if they broke, which is unlikely.

13. Lemme see now:
    weeks long journey
    some rough rides
    very hot
    might need to sleep in it (Army had tent sleeping; never again!)
    possibly very cold
    So, let’s go with 1992 Land Rover Defender 110 LS3.
    I know, British reliability, but I have a support vehicle
    Desirables:
    – longer wheel base makes a better ride than shorter ones. No mention of super tight U-turns requiring short wheelbase
    – probably has AC and a decent heater.
    – hard top – canvas tops are too vulnerable to tearing and leaking.
    – all glass, no plastic windows = good visibility
    – don’t need a roof rack for spares/gas/water, etc because support vehicle
    – looks like comfortable, adjustable seats
    – has auto trans. I have experienced that auto trans is better than manual in soft sandy conditions, and less tiring for the driver where constant gear changes go on forever. I assume it has a good trans cooler
    Cons – British, but support vehicle
    – dark color makes it an oven in the sun, but good AC

14. OK, I’m the odd man out here. First, I will admit to having owned several Willys and Broncos like the ones in the list, and my first choice would be the 1970 Bronco with the hardtop.

    That series of Bronco was a shortened Ford 4×4 light truck, with the same engine, drivetrain, and suspension, and a shortened frame. Notwithstanding an earlier comment, all those Broncos were carbureted (fuel injection was not common on U.S. vehicles until the late 1980s). The 70s Broncos were just like the 70s light trucks from all 4 U.S. manufacturers (yes there were 4) in those days – they were designed for durability, and in my opinion, represent the apotheosis of U.S. automotive engineering.

    Among all the vehicles on that list, the Bronco is the only one that is fully supported with parts and service. There are shops all along that route with men who know those vehicles backwards and forwards, and who have new old stock parts (brake shoes, water pumps, bearings, seals) still stashed in their shops. Also, you can order anything you need for those Broncos and get next-day delivery.

    The Willys in the list are fun, but they all have 6 volt electrical systems (with generators, not alternators) and parts are days away. The foreign vehicles are also nice, but If parts are needed, there might be weeks, or even months delays. I will not speak of Lucas electrics, except to say that I am among the very few men you will ever encounter who are fully conversant with 6 volt, positive earth vehicles – easy to diagnose but certain items may have very long lead times. The Toyotas are also nice, but like a lot of Japanese products, they are no longer supported (Japanese policy dictates vehicle replacement on a regular basis, no requirement for parts availability for discontinued vehicles, and not enough production of the vehicles in the list to support an after-market parts network).

    So for me, the 1970 Bronco hardtop, or if it’s already taken, the 1977 hardtop. I’m not a fan of ragtops. As a life-long defense man (20 years in the pros), I appreciate at least some layer of steel between myself and predators of any species.

    I can also speak from experience that with the 2nd-row seat folded down or removed, and the front seats tilted forward, 2 can sleep, or even recreate, comfortably in a 70s Bronco

    I did not show this list to my wife, because she has a long history with Land Rovers, before we met. Her preferences might diverge from mine.

    1. You know why so many Ford parts are available? Because anyone who owns a Ford needs those parts replaced on the regular.

       And I call bullshit on parts not being available for Toyotas. Between the choice of Oem or aftermarket or a used but working junk yard part you can surely find a yota part if needed.

       # Fuck Over Rebuilt DeLorean

15. My grand dad did that back in 62. He was a mechanic and he chose a 62 jeepster and took the box off and built a camper that rode there in place of the dump box. He would go out to Montana and follow a gravel road over the horizon. In honor of him I would chose one of the jeeps. Maybe range rovers are tougher but in the us that is moot.

    As to companions I would take my wife. But to each their own.

16. My choice:

    1995 “white submarine” G-wagen.

    Reasons: at that time, still made to Bundeswehr mil-spec — i.e. indestructible — and it’s not gonna break, ever. The ride is a little rough (it’s not at all like the more recent “limo” G550s), but much better than the FJ 40. (Yes, I’ve driven both.) AND it’s got the proven MB 2.9-liter turbo diesel.

    Companion: the Son&Heir. And he’s a Boy Scout (okay, Eagle), so making camp fires and cooking outdoor meals etc. is second nature to him.
    (I can’t think of a woman who could handle such a trip — especially New Wife, for whom “roughing it” means a Hilton.)

17. If I wanted to get there, the newest g wagon. Bit mean giving us a choice of a 90s merc and a 70s Toyota. If you’d included a 90s Land Cruiser that would be the obvious choice.

    Your Miss Sweeney looks the ideal companion.

18. If I were 40 years younger, I’d ride my Ducati Desert Sled.
    However, now that I’m in my mid-80’s, I just might pick a spot in eastern NV to wave at you as you go by.
    Have fun, everyone.

19. The ride- the ride is EVERYTHING. Try 100 miles of washboard. you desert and mountain dwellers know of what I speak. the ride would be my first , last , and only consideration.
    You did say support vehicle, yes?

20. Kim,

    Kim,

    My wife and I, by mistake, almost took a part of the Grand Canyon unpaved part of you trip. We drove from Peach Springs (AZ) up to the South Rim at Supai. Using the Rental Car Company map, I saw what looked like a short cut cutting across to Tusayan where we were staying. Within a quarter of a mile, the pot holes were deeper than our full sized rental.

    I swear I heard the Voice of God saying, “Turn around Idiot”.

    Best advice I ever took.

    JJ

21. Need: hard top, a/c, not ancient. Not an overly challenging trip as described.
    I was leaning toward the 95 Defender, but “British reliability” gave me pause. Does the LS swap fix that? Dunno.
    So, Kim’s comments swayed me to the 95 G wagon. I’d add a radio, if allowed. Enough room in back for some additional gear.
    My son (also an Eagle Scout) would be my companion of choice, since Mrs. Bix wouldn’t go. If my son couldn’t go, then best friend. I don’t prefer traveling with crowds.
    There would be some camping, but also some hotels for soft beds and showers.

    1. Also, this vehicle is listed as all mechanical with no electronics. That gives me a shiver up my leg

22. Since I already own it, can I just get my 1984 HJ 61 updated with 12HT motor, and otherwise “retromodded”?

    As a traveling companion, my dog and my wife.

    1. No.

Comments are closed.